Why Remoaners can’t let go of Russiagate

The spiked team discusses conspiracy theories, civil rights and Islamism.

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Topics Brexit Politics UK

Will the Brexit-Russia conspiracy theory ever die? Why have anti-racist activists lost faith in free speech? Is it offensive to use the word ‘Islamism’? Tom Slater, Ella Whelan, Fraser Myers, and special guest Kevin Yuill, discuss all this and more on this week’s spiked podcast.

Picture by: Getty.

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Comments

Ian Murray

30th July 2020 at 8:21 pm

Isn’t it more about how Brexiteers don’t care about sovereignty when it comes down to it?

Stef Steer

27th July 2020 at 10:15 am

Speaking of remoaners I was listening to talk radio and Adonis came on so I obviously switched off. but it popped into my head that he reminds me of a Harry Potter creature (Rowling is a big Labour donor so I wouldn’t actually be shocked if this was true) Dobby the house elf is a caricature of Adonis I swear.

Mor Vir

24th July 2020 at 11:16 pm

Fear of speaking is spreading throughout the political spectrum. This is an absurd situation and it needs to end.

> Everyone but far-left feels intimidated into silence, new survey finds

Even moderate liberals and Democrats are wary of expressing their opinions, according to respondents.

July 24, 2020 (LifeSiteNews) – Conservatives, centrists, and moderate liberals all feel afraid of speaking their minds for fear of reprisals, according to a disturbing new survey released this week by YouGov and the Cato Institute.

Sixty-two percent of respondents find that the current “political climate these days prevents them from saying things they believe because others might find them offensive,” with almost a third fearful that expressing disfavored opinions could get them fired, according to the survey.

Conservatives and Republicans felt self-censorship most intensely at 77 percent, though majorities of Democrats, Independents, centrist liberals, and moderates also answered that they felt the same way. “Strong liberals” were the only category in which a majority (58 percent) said they felt safe openly expressing themselves.

Every group feels less safe in speaking out than they did when the question was asked in 2017, with the most pronounced shifts occurring left-of-center. Only “strong conservatives” remained relatively constant, shifting just one percentage point.

The survey also found differences in how the two ends of the ideological spectrum would pressure others for contrary politics. Half of “strong liberals” endorsed the prospect of firing business executives for personally contributing to President Donald Trump’s re-election, whereas 36 percent of “strong conservatives” would do the same to executives who donated to former Vice President Joe Biden.

https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/everyone-but-far-left-feels-intimidated-into-silence-new-survey-finds

Gordon O Gopher

24th July 2020 at 11:30 pm

Yep. Socialist anti-semitism is still the acceptable form of racism. Which is quite ironic considering it was also the most destructive form of racism over the last 100 years or so.

T Zazoo

25th July 2020 at 2:23 am

Yep, I’m one of them. As a straight white male I am one wrong word, whether it be deliberate, accidental or just plain misheard, away from instant dismissal at any time.

That’s my safe space.

Jerry Owen

25th July 2020 at 11:14 am

Do you not get bored with copy and paste?

Mor Vir

25th July 2020 at 11:23 am

Not at all, it is sometimes the appropriate means of communication. You I find mildly irritating but I am guessing that your discomfort is greater so that is all for the good I suppose. : )

Darth Saddius

24th July 2020 at 10:18 pm

Why Spiked Online can’t let go of Remoaners more like.

Mark Lambert

24th July 2020 at 8:44 pm

Oh god, words.

If I called it “Islamic extremism/terrorism” would Ella challenge me?
Would she say that I should use “Islamist” because that is a separation from Islamic?
Is that because Islam has zero to do with Islamism?

Where have demands for this come from, asks Ella?
An imam, used by all media, last year told three LBC presenters to not use the words “Islamist”
or “Islamism”. The reason is dead obvious – defence of the faith. But it is also a censorship.

Cancel “Prevent”? That’s what all Islamists want.
We are told that “Prevent” also covers far-right extremism, but I hear nobody complaining about that,
and if they did, we would look quizzically at them.

Is “Islamist” the same as “Islamic fundamentalism”? How far has fundamentalism intruded on
“ordinary Muslims”? Once again, just because of words, you seem to be ignoring this and taking
the incredibly simple view that “Islamism”=bad, and “Islam”=all rosy in the garden.

What we have is Islamic extremism, which involves religious, societal and terrorism activities.
And then also decide if Islam is actually perfect for a modern secular society (or even a Christian
one) or actually lends itself far too easily at the very, very least, to religious extremism which for
many might be seen as normal.

Fancy having an adult conversation on that, rather than skirting it?

Christopher Tyson

24th July 2020 at 8:11 pm

In my politics class in school about 1980, we were given a hand out from an article from The Economist, it related to ‘The ‘Troubles’ in Northern Ireland, I don’t want to in to that, but the headline stayed with me ‘the two minority conundrum’ (the catholics a minority in the North, the protestants in the whole of Ireland). We were moving towards a universal victimhood.
I was in the cubs and the scouts, I grew up watching westerns and war movies (we called them films back then), played with toy guns, stood on the shed at Chelsea, but I was never particularly blokey, these things were mundane at the time and only look remarkable in retrospect; boys playing with guns, football hooliganism, even recently the scouting guru Baden-Powell have come under attack in recent years. By the 1980s memories of WW11 had started to fade and with it the need for tough men (industrial decline too).
I remember and economist headline in the 1990s ‘Black men need to step up to the plate’, this was an article in the bible of liberal capitalism that could have been written by a black radical feminist. In the UK there is only one black newspaper of note ‘The Voice’ in the 80s and 90s they too began to move toward a black radical feminist critique, the lead columnist at the time, Tony Sewell is now widely seen as a voice of moderation and has been appointed to lead the government’s race commission, times change, The Voice is perhaps more extreme than ever (identitarian, race obsessive) but still courted by major politicians like Johnson and Starmer. The uncritical adoption of black chauvinism by white liberals is rarely if ever discussed.
In the 1980s black working class men were fighting on many fronts, employers, police, the far right, and black radical feminism was the final blow. With the defeat of the black (male) working class, black people could be safely pitied and patronised.
Now the violence of the inner city riots terrified the British establishment and set the tone for there attitude to race relations, largely a policy of co-option and patronage which continues today. But like Kevin despite my defence of masculinity do not see anything these violent outbursts as positive, indeed I suspect that the powers that be can cope more easily with violence than with politics critique.
BLM have a feminist ethos.

Vivian Darkbloom

24th July 2020 at 10:01 pm

Yes Christopher I remember it well back in the 80s. “Black guys are so sexist”; I heard this a lot from both black and white women in London. Along came Acid House and Rave which blew it all away. There has been scant analysis of how this syncretic culture broke down racial and sexual barriers; of course the empathy drug MDMA helped, but it wasn’t all drug fuelled hedonism. This has been largely written out of history in favour of rock and the Cool Britannia media-created movement.

We have regressed. “They”, the powers that be in all their multifariousness, don’t want us to get along despite the fact that we clearly do; mixed marriages and liaisons have produced the third-largest and fastest-growing ethnic minority group in the UK (Source: The Telegraph). I mean, it’s absurd in a way. How can we be described as a “racist” nation when this is a fact. How can mixed people be described as ethnic minority when one of the parents belong to the predominant group? This is almost never taken into account. Is this some acknowledgement of the ridiculous 1 drop rule? My children are mixed and are better for it in the sense that they have a wider understanding of both difference and unity but they should not be forced to choose between what is increasingly becoming a new kind of apartheid. We used not to regard each other with suspicion; we left this to the USA and its legacy. This is, in many ways, a wonderful country when such things as rave can happen almost spontaneously and outwith state control. But we are being sucked into the USA identity wars where, as Europeans of all colours, we don’t belong. So much of what passes for intellectual analysis coming out of the USA strikes me as colonialism and American exceptionalism. I mean, the US woke never seem to talk about Africa. Just have a look at African Twitter for an eye-opener. It rarely seems to cross African American minds that they are spitting USA exceptionalism and intellectual colonialism merely from a black perspective just like their white compatriots. America is the centre of the world, eh?

“With the defeat of the black (male) working class, black people could be safely pitied and patronised.” Yes, to expand, the defeat of the working class overall. Your comment struck me with the hammer-blow of truth: BLM is led by women. You have highlighted an aspect that almost nobody has remarked upon. Until I read your comment it hadn’t really entered my mind but you are correct. We live in the centre of London and have observed the marches. Black and white women were over represented, especially white women. This is a phenomenon that is under-reported. Hmm, I’ll have to think about this. Very insightful.

Christopher Tyson

25th July 2020 at 8:30 am

Ended abruptly there, only had one job to do, typical man, burning dinner.

Christopher Tyson

25th July 2020 at 8:53 am

The BLM association with feminist is not my invention their founders were ‘intersectionalist’ women, womanist, so they might object to ‘feminists’, for most of us these are minor distinctions.
More importantly I was making the case for aims, objectives and strategy, a more militaristic approach. The point of being a soldier is to maintain your own discipline, hopefully to achieve your aims without the need for war, but being prepared to fight if you have to. Perhaps even have some respect for your enemy certainly for their capabilities.
Indetitatirans seem to be plating at militancy, as a minority why would you provoke a confrontation with a majority that you have already defined as hostile to you? In the UK the reality is that the identitarians have friends in high places, are bold and confident. They might say that their approach is in the non violent tradition of MLK, and to be fair we can see those elements, but with no clear aims and objectives, there is no logical end to their protests. We have seen that protests simply evolve, merge, fragment, there is an eternal protest which becomes an end in itself, ‘us good, you bad’.
Feminists and other identitarians do not challenge oppression in principle, they seek advancement within the status quo, so women oppressing women or black people oppressing other black people is simply not an issue for them. The leaders of these groups are generally educated and middle class and they will see themselves as future leaders on a bigger stage, their self image is of radicals and counter-culturalists, but they will join a ruling elite which does not recognise itself as such. Indeed many of these people are professors and PhDs, and I’m no longer surprised to hear people who have reached the higher echelons of academy who seem, to put it kindly, intellectually deficient, the childish nonsense that some of them come out with.

KATHLEEN CARR

24th July 2020 at 7:44 pm

All the Western communists who were well rewarded when the Soviet Union was communist have been very disappointed in the new Russia and take any opportunity to try to harm it. If Putin supposedly wanted Scotland to be independent in 2014 ( when they would have wanted to still be part of EU ) and yet still supported Brexit in 2016 ( which means we leave the EU ) doesn’t make any sense and its not supposed to -its just a political distraction by people who only like democracy when the vote goes their way.

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