‘Leave voters are right to be angry’ – Brendan O’Neill on Moral Maze

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Topics Brexit Politics UK

spiked’s editor appears on BBC Radio 4’s Moral Maze to argue that Brexit is being betrayed and voters are right to feel angry about that.

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Comments

Jim Lawrie

12th October 2019 at 12:37 am

“Women who leave Parliament in tears”. Actually, they are MP’s. A female turning on the water works is saying “Look how I weep. A man has said something so bad that I am crying. That man must not be allowed to do this again. That man must be shut up. I cannot silence him because I have not the wit to do so.”
They cannot handle it, so they should chuck it.

Jim Lawrie

12th October 2019 at 12:43 am

It is a pathetic resort and appeal to emotion. Real women should harpoon them for it.

John Reic

11th October 2019 at 6:30 pm

It was said when Female remain Amal’s leave parliament in. Tears leavers should watch their language

Caroline Flint hasn’t bern called a racist traitor and bigot
Gisela stuart A Nazi Kate hoey was called a betrayer and a absolute disgrace and it’s a shameful fact she’s a mp and that was by Anna Turley a mp in a leave area

Other people like dreda Say mitchell were called uncle toms By remainers
Where’s the outrage there

Perverted Lesbian

11th October 2019 at 1:06 pm

It isn’t complicated, it has been made complicated, deliberately by people who do not want us to leave the EU.
It is quite clear, we either get a deal or we leave on no deal, as it appears that there not a deal that can get a majority through parliament we then leave on NO DEAL.

Amelia Cantor

11th October 2019 at 11:11 am

But why isn’t Comrade-Commentator Brendan actually a panellist on the Moral Maze? Isn’t it about time that the RCP inserts a few agents of influence into the nation’s broadcaster? We need some strong voices standing up for free speech, open borders, common sense on trans issues and other core Enlightenment values.

Andrew Leonard

11th October 2019 at 12:54 pm

“We need some strong voices standing up for free speech, open borders, common sense on trans issues and other core Enlightenment values.”

Comrade Cantor, have you just defected to the Libertarian Party?

Christopher Tyson

10th October 2019 at 9:58 am

I heard the show and it did appear as though it was Taylor who was angry with O’Neill. Taylor was dismissing O’Neill as some kind of contrarian, and worse calling his integrity in to doubt. But caricature can cut both ways, it would be easy to dismiss Taylor as a Blairite insider who simply joined the family business in media and academia. O’Neill modestly acknowledged that like Taylor he had a platform and an outlet for his views. It might be an exaggeration to say that O’Neill was an oik who had dragged himself up out of the ghetto by his bootstraps, I’m sure also that Taylor’s life hasn’t been all easy peasy either. As Paddy McAloon (esteemed songwriter) sings ‘it takes such an effort to stay where I am’. Us working class boys made good like me and O’Neill we have to struggle to get anywhere and stay anywhere, then we turn up like interlopers.. Again I’m being simplistic, talk to my mother and she will tell you (at some length) of all my cousins who have become lawyers and ‘done well’ unlike her underachieving offspring ( my brother retorts that at least we all got jobs and none of us is in prison). I’m sure that even in the O’Neill family there are those who have done well, indeed appearing on a show on radio 4, would count as doing well. Yes I’m rambling to my point that the middle class and the working class meet at certain points, they don’t own capital they work for someone they are not in charge of their own destiny. The middle class have more control and more choices, they also have more to lose. So snobbery and antipathy from the middle class stems from the drive to protect their social position. They characterise brexiteers as lowlifes and racist, and they can deal with this, they have more difficulty with the upwardly mobile, aspiring or ambitious working class, the people who will be competing with them for jobs and houses, social power and influence. As I always say I’m a glass half full kind of guy, there is a way out, indeed, to use a good Marxist word, it is inevitable, the middle class will fall into the working class, indeed revolutionary leaders are often people whose families or who themselves have made this descent, so welcome to the struggle my middle class brothers and sisters, we will not eat you.

John Millson

10th October 2019 at 10:16 am

(For some, ‘Clogs to clogs in three generations’)
Yep, we all ‘commoners’ really. A significant number of Brexiters are not, or don’t see themselves as such.

Andrew Leonard

10th October 2019 at 8:55 am

It is fairly obvious that the Brexit bottleneck is a lack of desire to make it happen, rather than the complications involved.
However, does this point to a deeper malaise?
Does the UK really want to govern itself at all?
Is there a feeling that the UK deserves to be occupied by a foreign power?
The EU will fairly soon have its own defence forces, making it a state in its own right. Macron has nominated the United States as a potential enemy, and a reason for establishing the EU’s own armed forces. Is this thinking widely shared in the UK?
Brendan, you will hate me for saying this, but is a nation lacking the desire to self-govern, really going to benefit from Brexit?
What are the chances that within 20 years, the UK becomes a state of the US of E, in the same sense that California is a state of the US of A?

John Millson

10th October 2019 at 8:23 am

A ‘soft Brexit’ is still a Brexit. It is so disingenuous to say that it isn’t.
Had Boris Johnson, the vote winner, negotiated the same withdrawal agreement as Theresa May, the vote loser, the UK would have been in transition phase for the last 6 months and all the ‘oppressed’, ‘voiceless’, leavers and remainers, would be getting on with their lives now.
I really hope there aren’t shortages, job losses, security breaches etc. because of a ‘no deal’ situation, but the people, (any of us) who might be affected would have the absolute right to be *terrifylingly* angry, not any armchair, pipe and slipper ‘clean’ Brexit anarchists.
Get real; get intellectually honest.

Jerry Owen

10th October 2019 at 11:33 am

John MIllson
You have never got over your loss , you still attend anti Brexit demos.
You are either in a club or you are not . We voted not to be in the club .
It’s about time you got honest with yourself isn’t it ?

John Millson

10th October 2019 at 12:57 pm

Jerry Owen
Oh dear. I don’t attend anti-brexit demos; I have got over my ‘loss’. Be honest with *yourself*. You’re an intelligent person, presumably with enough common sense. Leaving the EU was never going to be simple. It’s not analogous to leaving a ‘club’. Yes we were told leaving the EU means leaving SM & CU but no one could have thought, ‘that means leave overnight’.

Jerry Owen

10th October 2019 at 3:02 pm

J Millson
You told us about a month ago you attended an anti Brexit demo in London do you deny it now ?
Who said anything about leaving the EU ‘overnight ‘ , just you apparently, the rest of us just expected to leave as promised by our government in an orderly way.
Clearly you haven’t got over your loss, you posted about Brexit on BONs article about Harry and Meghan’s war on the press, which had nothing to do with Brexit easily found by anyone here if they so wish, such is your clear anger.
You had a little rant which you later admitted was embarrassing. amongst other things you said ..’Brexit has now revealed itself as a wheeze , urged on by malcontent cockroaches ‘ and ‘ Northern ireland alone should stop Brexit you idiots ‘.
You are still a bitter little remoaner some three and a half years on. Go on John be brave own your own bitterness !!

John Millson

10th October 2019 at 3:33 pm

I have never been on an expressly anti-Brexit demo. The only recent demo I attended was about the unlawful Prorogation by the Tory government of Parliament.
The Brexit Project is a pathetic delusion urged on by bourgeois pigs (and ‘cockroaches’), those who will lose very little, if anything.
Long live the EU. (Long live Germany, a country which has come to terms with its past. (Now it’s time for England & Wales to assess themselves properly.))
There wil be a reckoning.
Bitter?…

Jerry Owen

10th October 2019 at 4:54 pm

I saw the banners on that demo you went on, they were anti Brexit. So you did try to deny the fact that you did indeed go on an anti Brexit demo, tut tut !
If you think the Germans have come to terms with their past you are somewhat deluded.
The Germans never lost their past, they are busy creating an empire without a single shot being fired so far.
The people of this country have assessed themselves by deciding to leave the undemocratic EU.
BTW how as a people can we affect the direction of the EU ? How can we appoint or remove the EU commissioners ?
Bitter ? Yes you clearly are.

Jerry Owen

10th October 2019 at 4:55 pm

Verhofstadt himself has in fact admitted that the EU is an Empire in the making.
Not good eh ?

John Millson

10th October 2019 at 5:37 pm

Bonkers, man.
Either taking the piss or I was mistaken – not that intelligent. Whatever…clearly fit the typical resentful & ignorant Leave voter profile. Your type are the ones with decades of bitterness behind them.

Jerry Owen

10th October 2019 at 5:46 pm

John Millson
I was hoping you could address my questions about my concerns with the democracy lacking EU seeing as you are such an avid fan, indeed such a fan that Brexit supporters are cockroaches apparently.
But all you have is insults yet again .. oh dear, nothing like a sore loser eh John !!

H McLean

9th October 2019 at 10:24 pm

Given the level of deliberate pig-headedness of the presenter and the rank bad-faith argument of the woman who chimes in @4:50 determined to pin Brendan in a petty Kafka trap of language policing, it’s hardly surprising that this was a BBC show. I’m a Brit who did not take part in the referendum as I have lived abroad for decades. I am furious at the way British politicians and the media bourgeoisie have conspired to twist and deny Brexit, so I can only imagine how strongly the British public feel about this deliberately engineered fracas but I expect their dejection and feeling of betrayal is far stronger.

Jerry Owen

10th October 2019 at 11:43 am

H McLean
It was when the whining woman started talking about female MPs crying I seemed to come over in a sort of sleepy haze. Brendan gave good account under such boring repetitive duress.
The time has come for ‘street action’ , possibly a more diplomatic word than ‘riots’ for Brendan to use in ‘polite media society’.

Jim Lawrie

12th October 2019 at 12:25 am

He should have told her that a grasp of words and of grammar are the building blocks of language and discussion. That it is not his job to educate her in these, and then recommended English remedial classes.
But of course her asking what simple words and phrases mean is an attempt to waste Brendan’s opportunity to put a message across.

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